~ Recent blog post: This is our day. at http://lazyvegan.wordpress.com ~

“And often, the meat-eaters gradually morph into a child-like role, as I explain how cow’s milk is really made, and why the US has such high rates of heart disease and cancer, and how cheese has opiate-like substances, and how tastes can change, and how deep inside all of want to be decent people and not harm others for pleasure or out of habit. If all goes well, these people who were paternalistic and even condescending might say to me two weeks later, “Hey, you’d be proud of me, I ordered a bean burrito with no meat,” and seek my approval, praise, and encouragement.”

You know Gary, I never interpreted this common occurrence in the way you just have; however, I do believe that you may be correct. I often hear similar things: the one-time paternalist speaks of her vegetarian dinner the next time we speak. Perhaps this suggests some truth to my argument (i.e., discomfort disguised as care), but even further, as you argue, it’s evidence of their internal discomfort with their own actions and (as I say) unfolding the logic of our strongly held premise against unnecessary suffering.

~ Recent blog post: Non-lethal police techniques needed, desperately. at http://www.not-quiteright.net/tvg ~

I know what you mean. I suppose pretending to be knowledgeable is a superficial and/or maybe reflexive type of defense mechanism.

All these defenses indicate guilt to me. Guilt and fear – of confronting one’s sins and shortcomings. I try, though not always successfully, to leverage that in ways that won’t simply cause those deeply vested in meat-eating to raise their shields.

I certainly don’t have any sure-fire methods; I just improvise. It helps to have an array of knowledge tidbits at the ready, but OTOH there’s nothing wrong with saying “That’s a good point; I don’t know the answer.” I’ll let them know I used to like meat, had the same concerns, did the research…and that might segue into talking about studies that show the health dangers of animal protein and saturated fat and CAFOs…and I try to end with a couple of practical suggestions, e.g., “try the veggie bacon and sausage since processed meats are especially deadly.”

And often, the meat-eaters gradually morph into a child-like role, as I explain how cow’s milk is really made, and why the US has such high rates of heart disease and cancer, and how cheese has opiate-like substances, and how tastes can change, and how deep inside all of want to be decent people and not harm others for pleasure or out of habit. If all goes well, these people who were paternalistic and even condescending might say to me two weeks later, “Hey, you’d be proud of me, I ordered a bean burrito with no meat,” and seek my approval, praise, and encouragement.

I know this has happened to many vegans. It’s an interesting dynamic. The non-vegan, espcially if s/he makes baby steps to divest from meat, recognizes that we (vegans) have resisted the societal and familial pressure to eat animals and, in a major way, lived according to our morals. They also recognize, at least subconsciously, that it can be scary to leave a comfort zone and to challenge one’s self-image. (I believe that for many people, their carnivorism and/or adoption of a mainstream diet is part of their self-image.) These realizations may be the basis for the child-like wonder and need for hand-holding when they try to break those bonds and give up animal products. I do try to let non-vegans know that the spiritual rewards are magnificent. It’s so great to be free from having to engage in denial, unconvincing rationalizations, or defense mechanisms about your diet; it’s wonderful to have a more honest and communal relationship with animals and the world.

(Sorry, super-long comment. It started off short and meandered out of control.)